tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post2284386331075117163..comments2023-12-24T11:20:38.708+00:00Comments on The Muniment Room: The Hail Mary In The Bidding PrayersTtonyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15185875893212146794noreply@blogger.comBlogger18125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-78101924775280110282012-05-30T14:11:34.642+01:002012-05-30T14:11:34.642+01:00No mention of the Hail Mary in Cardinal Heenan'...No mention of the Hail Mary in Cardinal Heenan's autobiography. He was only just beginning to unpick the "spirit" of VII towards the end of Part 2, pub. 1974. But no part 3. He died in 1975.Gentyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05569143943867323153noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-57072749735161550082012-05-28T13:11:13.032+01:002012-05-28T13:11:13.032+01:00Removal Company, do I hear an echo in your post?Removal Company, do I hear an echo in your post?Sixupmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12486627001579821658noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-50764128144428933172012-05-28T12:32:16.718+01:002012-05-28T12:32:16.718+01:00If this is the only alleged liturgical abuse which...If this is the only alleged liturgical abuse which comes to the mind of +Conry, what a sheltered life he must leave. Or is he being highly selective?Removal Companyhttp://www.andrewporterltd.co.uknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-48689910538730427882012-05-27T20:28:25.208+01:002012-05-27T20:28:25.208+01:00Ches: how excellently put! Well done!
I bet they ...Ches: how excellently put! Well done!<br /><br />I bet they won't publish it though.Ttonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15185875893212146794noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-9938945729973750312012-05-27T18:14:36.452+01:002012-05-27T18:14:36.452+01:00On the topic, I addressed the following letter to ...On the topic, I addressed the following letter to the editor of the Catholic Herald last week:<br /><br />Dear Sir,<br /><br />I note with curiosity Bishop Kieran Conry's opposition to the use of the Hail Mary during the Prayer of the Faithful, and with even greater curiosity, the pretext for his opposition: the desire to follow the mind of the Universal Church. I congratulate the bishop on this new orientation and hope in particular that it will also guide his attitudes towards the links between contraception and abortion, or towards the practice of frequent confession, or the problems of secularization: on all these topics, as reported in various issues of The Catholic Herald, Bishop Conry's views have not hitherto been distinguished by any such desire.<br /><br />If we, nevertheless, engage with the 2005 Arundel and Brighton guidelines for the Prayer of the Faithful, we might be dismayed to read that 'a set of prayers directed to the Father, through the Son and in the power of the Holy Spirit, contains 'no obvious place' for prayers to the saints [my emphasis].' On the contrary, since the saints are mentioned several times in the course of the prayers of the Mass, and within the Eucharistic Prayer itself, the very opposite seems to be the case. Properly understood, our worship of God is not undermined, but rather complemented, by our relationship to the saints, and supremely by our relationship to the Mother of God who is the examplar of everything that the Mass is intended to achieve in us.<br /><br />That seems obvious to me anyway. I'm sorry to hear the same is not the case in Arundel and Brighton.<br /><br />Best wishes, etc.Cheshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14482248798568539188noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-45608718818403396422012-05-23T18:08:36.584+01:002012-05-23T18:08:36.584+01:00Sixupman: What would the prayers be for? The quest...Sixupman: What would the prayers be for? The question of the sovereignty of the Holy See is not in issue, and Russians are now free to worship as they choose.Evagriusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-71502658288104931232012-05-23T07:11:22.522+01:002012-05-23T07:11:22.522+01:00Keep The Hail Mary:
Rather re-instate the Leonine...Keep The Hail Mary:<br /><br />Rather re-instate the Leonine Prayers after Mass.Sixupmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12486627001579821658noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-33886675871876388772012-05-23T04:00:59.394+01:002012-05-23T04:00:59.394+01:00You may be interested in following and sharing thi...You may be interested in following and sharing this campaign - thank you!<br /><br />Keep The Hail Mary In Our Mass is a UK Campaign set up to generate awareness and support to preserve the much loved Catholic tradition of praying & saying the Hail Mary as part of our Sunday Mass. <br /><br />This is following Bishop Kieran Conry of Arundel & Brightons potentially catastrophic decision to drop & exclude the Hail Mary in Sunday Mass.<br /><br />Please follow on Twitter:<br />@keepthehailmary<br /><br />Facebook Page<br /><br />Keep The Hail Mary In Our Mass<br /><br />I will be writing to Bishop Conry with all the support and hope he reverses this insane decision.<br /><br />Email: keepthehailmary@gmail.comKeepTheHailMaryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06953878630627593080noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-48179551545194937452012-05-22T22:55:55.308+01:002012-05-22T22:55:55.308+01:00Could someone please inform various Americans, pro...Could someone please inform various Americans, pronouncing from vertiginous equines on this subject, of this point, please?Evagrius Ponticusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-19872716820981596192012-05-22T11:07:47.523+01:002012-05-22T11:07:47.523+01:00On the subject of Easter Bunny Masses: HCPT, the s...On the subject of Easter Bunny Masses: HCPT, the showcase of liturgical participation, sine qua non, is always a useful place to look for reassurance. Last year they embraced that paragon of paediatric patrimony and asked HE Cardinal Brady to preach at the Trust Mass. An occasion that may have raised the hackles of hypocrisy was ennobled by the diligent activity of a rabbit sitting on his shoulder and nodding at appropriate intervals- the Easter Bunny and Palm Sunday Donkey united in celebration!<br />however, this post was intended as a testimony to our beloved brother Kieran, Lord Bishop of Arundel and Brighton, or Arrogant and Beautiful. At this years Trust Mass the orthodox prelate concelebrated and as so many of his co-concelebrants sported the most wonderful headgear from the simple knitted variety to the expansive Stetson to the oh so last year rabbits' ears, he our paragon of his own orthodoxy (or might we daringly call it idiodoxy?) resolutely refused to bear his own silly hat- how self effacingly modest.Omphalomancerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14650498011295065898noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-12683679509208302272012-05-21T19:00:37.204+01:002012-05-21T19:00:37.204+01:00The story I heard was that people started using ot...The story I heard was that people started using other prayers, like the memorare, and the bishops thought they'd better ask permission. According to the story, Rome said that no, and that the Hail Mary should not be used either, but the bishops suppressed the ruling.<br /><br />As for mass in a foreign language; I once went to Mass in Polish. But it was still the Mass. I joined in, only in Englihs, and I sang, only I 'lad' instead. No need to pray the rosary during Mass at all. At Mass, we celebrate Mass; being in the same place praying private prayers does not count.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-31952068315765448152012-05-20T08:49:30.313+01:002012-05-20T08:49:30.313+01:00I understand from an elderly priest friend that Bi...I understand from an elderly priest friend that Bishop Gordon Wheeler (Leeds) was instrumental in obtaining this permission. Having at one time lived in A & B I can recognise, sadly, at least some of what Peter Crawley says, although I might have expressed it differently!Mater marihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11728398207770659181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-74740507782425935172012-05-19T20:06:25.432+01:002012-05-19T20:06:25.432+01:00This could have been turned into an opportunity to...This could have been turned into an opportunity to reinstate the prayers at the foot of the altar after Mass.<br />I don't think Bishop Conry understands Catholicism. Unfortunately for A&B he's comparatively young, juvenile even, and this is about as far as he goes.<br />One hopes and prays that the new Nuncio will punch a hole in the Irish mafia with the next tranche of bishops.<br />I'll look through the autobiography of Card. Heenan and see what I can find.Gentyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05569143943867323153noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-50425978132140842352012-05-19T19:41:54.177+01:002012-05-19T19:41:54.177+01:00Arundel and Brighton abuses: how about the Bishop ...Arundel and Brighton abuses: how about the Bishop including the name of an Anglican Bishop in the Eucharistic Prayer, what about his one handed elevation, what about women's feet being washed, what about priests co-celebrating with Anglican female priests, what about some priests refusing to use the new translations, what about the widespread use of ceramic vessels, what about the bishop celebrating Mass for teachers and passing the chalice around, what about the use of non-scriptural readings at Mass, what about powerpoint homilies, what about the bishops Confirmations which look more like graduation ceremonies, what about the bishop riding out of Mass on a scooter, what about widespread lay purification of vessels? What about the Bishop refusing to wear his proper vestments? I could go on it just makes me angry, but this strikes me as attack by a sad man on Marian devotion, on Catholicism, which he really doesn't understand - he's barking and dangerous!Peter Crawleynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-64184993704692638102012-05-19T19:36:17.759+01:002012-05-19T19:36:17.759+01:00Check out our discussion on facebook:
Richard Dun...Check out our discussion on facebook:<br /><br />Richard Duncan If Our Lady is the mediatrix of all graces, it is surely a little odd not to ask her to associate her prayers with ours? The problem here is "hyper-liturgism", i.e. the tendency to privilege liturgical prayer over all other forms of prayer, even in circumstances where this is not helpful or approriate for particular individuals. Hyper-liturgism also looks down its nose at saying the rosary during mass, despite the fact that for some people (e.g. those for whom the vernacular is not their first language) this might be the only way in which they can participate in the liturgy.<br /><br />http://www.facebook.com/jackie.parkesAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-40710700740674492352012-05-19T17:56:29.605+01:002012-05-19T17:56:29.605+01:00It was included in the 'official' book of ...It was included in the 'official' book of the Prayer of the Faithful in use in many parishes from vernacular day until the mid 70's - the one from which we used to pray for "Our Sovereign Lady, Queen Elizabeth and all members of the Royal Family" on a regular basis.<br />I think the introduction to the Hail Mary went along the lines of.... We ask the glorious and ever-virgin Mother of God to intercede for all God's people livjng and dead..all a bit vague now. I can't imagine the venerable Canon who was our parish priest in those days permitting anything to be used that wasn't thoroughly approved of and with containing a decree in Latin!<br /><br />I really think that the good bishop would be better employed with encouraging people to rediscover the Sacrament of Reconciliation.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-65875302937111987572012-05-19T17:26:22.609+01:002012-05-19T17:26:22.609+01:00If this is the only alleged liturgical abuse which...If this is the only alleged liturgical abuse which comes to the mind of +Conry, what a sheltered life he must leave. Or is he being highly selective?Sixupmanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12486627001579821658noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-85176355467644473042012-05-19T16:07:36.268+01:002012-05-19T16:07:36.268+01:00It is interesting his Lordship himself says for th...It is interesting his Lordship himself says for the Pope's visit in the draft of the Liturgy the Hail Mary was included, and removed by the Office for Papal Liturgy.<br />The point is our own experts were confident enough to include it, the OPL understandably rejected a local custom from a broadcast Papal Liturgy.georgenoreply@blogger.com