tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post7286315595156831748..comments2023-12-24T11:20:38.708+00:00Comments on The Muniment Room: A Question For Liturgical HistoriansTtonyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15185875893212146794noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-20829436456845736512015-03-02T19:59:47.493+00:002015-03-02T19:59:47.493+00:00Rubricarius, was it this?
Oratio Postcommunioni A...Rubricarius, was it this?<br /><br />Oratio Postcommunioni Addenda<br /><br />Et famulos tuos N. Papam, N. Antistitem nostry, N. regem nostrum, cum domo regia, cum populo et exercitu ipsi commissis, ab omni adversitate custodi; pacem tuam nostris concede temporibus, et an Ecclesia tua cunctam repelle nequitiam. Per Dominum.<br /><br />This was the prayer Pope Gregory XVI was so scandalised by. He asked Wiseman in 1847 to have it stopped. Bishop Baines (VA Western District) agreed to stop it; Bishop Milner (VA Midland District (though earlier)) had never allowed it to be said, thinking it an abuse; while Bishop Griffiths (VA London District) had it said in his District every day until his death in 1847.<br /><br />Ttonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15185875893212146794noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-71152720924376426752015-03-02T18:59:57.223+00:002015-03-02T18:59:57.223+00:00Ttony, IIRC it was a post-communion.Ttony, IIRC it was a post-communion.Rubricariushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05050302650867319277noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-31616296668347641792015-03-01T10:57:12.792+00:002015-03-01T10:57:12.792+00:00I'm pretty confident that the prayers for the ...I'm pretty confident that the prayers for the Royal family were introduced simply as a token of recognition for the fact that Catholicism had been decriminalised, as it were. Catholics worshiping legally were bound to pray for their sovereigns. The surprise is that the prayers should be inserted in the Mass. Rubricarius: is the prayer you refer to a postcommunion or a prayer after Mass?<br /><br />What becomes more and more clear is that the Catholic Church in England and Wales after the Catholic Relief Act and up to the Restoration of the Hierarchy was fairly Gallican in its relationship with Rome. Wiseman's triumph (Discuss) was to reintegrate England and Wales with Rome.Ttonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15185875893212146794noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-74526643670983487212015-03-01T09:40:25.194+00:002015-03-01T09:40:25.194+00:00A friend of mine has a layman's Missal of the ...A friend of mine has a layman's Missal of the period with the oration for HM King George, Queen Charlotte and the Royal Issue. I wonder if there was an element of gratitude as the King had given some of his own money to support Maynooth?Rubricariushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05050302650867319277noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-44568003846261154022015-02-26T19:50:23.520+00:002015-02-26T19:50:23.520+00:00Anon: the insertion in the Canon was decided by th...Anon: the insertion in the Canon was decided by the Vicars Apostolic themselves. The Government came up with an Oath for Catholics to swear to prove their loyalty.<br /><br />The <i>Salvum fac</i> is a prayer for the Monarch, said outside the Mass itself, as was the custom for non-Catholic princes. That prayer, or a similar one, would, I believe, be said by Catholics in any non-Catholic kingdom.Ttonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15185875893212146794noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-77062022349885502072015-02-26T11:16:37.995+00:002015-02-26T11:16:37.995+00:00The Leeds Diocesan archives contain a report of 18...The Leeds Diocesan archives contain a report of 1823 by the Vicar Apostolic of the Northern<br />District on the state of Catholicism<br />in his district at that time. Prepared for Propaganda Fide. I always thought that the Prayer for the King/Queen after the main Mass on Sundays (Domine salvam fac.) sung until Vatican 2, was required by the Government as a<br />condition of granting some freedom<br />of practice to Catholics by the Relief Act. Was the addition to the canon a similar requirement?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-31967086736266667232015-02-23T20:37:54.821+00:002015-02-23T20:37:54.821+00:00Agellus: many thanks. I have downloaded the book t...Agellus: many thanks. I have downloaded the book to read it all. It explains how the custom had decayed into an extra postcommunion, but not what impelled the Vicars Apostolic. but guess that I'm going to have to get hold of "The Eve" and "The Dawn" as well, at some point. <br /><br />I wish somebody would write a straightforward history of the Catholic Church in England and Wales 1780 to 1903, the death of Bourne, the last of the Archbishops of Westminster to have known pre-Restoration Catholic life.Ttonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15185875893212146794noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-37512247.post-76305361478552230462015-02-23T19:25:32.147+00:002015-02-23T19:25:32.147+00:00There is mention of the aberrant practice in Ward&...There is mention of the aberrant practice in Ward's <i><a href="https://books.google.com/books?id=8xKxAAAAMAAJ&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q&f=false" rel="nofollow">Sequel to Catholic Emancipation</a></i> on page 201, as well as Wiseman's opposition to it.Agellusnoreply@blogger.com